Preacher's Point Special Meeting - June 14, 2008
Location: Jim W.'s garage, Redstone Lake
Weather: Variable; showers
Chair: Dave L.
Present
Jim W., Road Manager emeritus
Dave L., treasurer
Marguerite L., Secretary
Gwen W.
Boyd R.
Brad and Shannon R.
Paul and Grazyna C. (arrived late)
Rachel and Andrew S
The meeting
Preamble
This meeting has been called by Road Manger Jim W. and Treasurer Dave L. to address concerns that have arisen due to both recent and past events.
These concerns stem from recent extreme weather conditions, change of property ownership, change of road usage, collection of road dues and ever-increasing fees from our associated road associations (Miller’s Bay and East Bay Cottage Association).
Jim and Dave have discussed these matters over the past year along with ideas from Boyd R. and Chris C. as we look to the future direction of our Preachers Point Road and Road Association. This document puts forth these ideas for discussion.
The bottom line is that we are seeing road costs, usage and requirements increase while available funds for our own area of road maintenance are decreasing to an unsustainable level.
Overview of this Meeting
Update of member’s personal info: address, phone, email, web access
Where do we go from here?
Creation of local bylaws
Road Manager has resigned
Road Issues
Fee structure
Collection of fees
Other issues
Background
Our road was originally built ten years ago as a summer season cottage road. I personally feel that the finished product was a far better road than we had expected and that we were all generally quite satisfied with it. As we only used our cottages in the late-spring/summer/early-fall weather, with winter access by snowmobile or skis, the road was more than adequate to serve our needs.
However, we naively did not anticipate that cottages would be sold and new owners would build four-season homes and would desire to have road access year-round, including during the questionable Spring thaw period.
We now have a situation where some members are satisfied with the road as-is and others not only want the road quality improved, but they also want full access over the winter season. Even if these members are willing to cover the plowing costs in the winter months, it leaves the serious problem of gravel and road materials erosion from the plowing process and the attendant increased road maintenance costs.
Adding to the mix of problems is the apparent difficulty that some cottagers (some on fixed incomes) are having with the current road fees and the reality that more funds are necessary.
And now, our Road Manager has resigned.
Where do we go from here?
At this time, we have a number of options available as we continue to use and maintain this road into the future. These options include the following, which are presented only as a starting point for the discussion of “Where do we go from here”.
Option 1: Continue on with the current agreement and improve the road quality to allow spring and winter usage. This would likely result in significant new charges for capital costs and a substantial increase in the ongoing road fees. Estimates based on other road associations could indicate a $1000 annual fee and capital costs could reach or exceed the full amount we paid initially to build the road.
Those who wish to winter plow the road would cover the costs (including gravel replacement) between them as a separate item.Option 2: Continue on with the current agreement but adjust the fee structure to accommodate those who will benefit from improved road quality and those who will not.
One idea is to calculate the total road budget needed for a given year and proportion it to each residence in the same ratio as their property assessment. This has the advantages of being easily implemented and echoing the way roads are taxed throughout most municipalities.
Another idea is to proportion the costs based on estimated usage – semi-permanent residents would pay a much larger percentage (this could be difficult to calculate in such a way as to satisfy all parties).
Those who wish to winter plow the road would cover the costs (including gravel replacement) between them as a separate item.Option 3: Abandon the Preachers Point Road association as it currently exists. Road users would then be individually responsible for paying their share (currently $200) to the Millers Lake Association. Any persons wanting to improve or maintain the road would “take up a collection” as required and use the moneys raised to do the work. Those that did not want or need the improvements could choose not to contribute.
Those who wish to winter plow the road would cover the costs (including gravel replacement) between them as a separate item.Option 4: Abandon the Preachers Point Road association as it currently exists and merge with the Millers Lake Association. I believe there is interest here as it reduces the duplication of effort and spreads any costs out over a larger group, while making available more people’s talents to use.
Those who wish to winter plow the road would cover the costs (including gravel replacement) between them as a separate item.Option 5: Petition the local council to create a special “Cottage Road Category” not requiring the prohibitively large setbacks and unnecessarily high standards and take over the road maintenance, adding the costs to our property taxes. This is attractive as they have the proper equipment to easily maintain the road and should be able to do it far cheaper than we can. Our property taxes are already in the extreme and likely already include road maintenance fees and it should be possible to add our road to the system for very little addition taxation.
Option 6: Any combination of the above options, or any new ideas presented at this meeting.
Resolved at the meeting:
Whereas Boyd and Chris have paid $5765 (tax Included) to have major road repairs done
Whereas additional association funds of $3200 will be allocated for approximately 10 loads of limestone to do further repairs
Whereas these improvements will bring the road condition back to an acceptable standard;
Therefore, it was agreed to continue with the status quo, namely leaving the association intact, with the existing fee structure modified slightly as per Item 5 below.
Item 1 -- Local Bylaws
One of the intents for this meeting is to formalize a simple set of local Bylaws for our Preacher’s Point section of the road (currently our ten members).
The intent is to set down a list of issues and solutions so that everyone understands them and we are all in agreement with our future direction.
We will publish the proposed bylaws in preliminary form (paper and internet website www.preacherspoint.com) for all cottagers to comment on and hopefully finalize them before the year is out, with all members signing that they are in agreement and will abide by the bylaws.
Resolved at the meeting:
Bylaws will be developed in as simple a format as possible, maximum two pages in length.
Bylaws to be presented to the membership via the website (www.preacherspoint.com) and email for comments and revisions and finally acceptance.
Brad will locate a copy of East Bay Road Association’s agreement as a starting model.
Item 2 -- Resignation of Road Manager
Jim W. has resigned as Road Manager after more than 10 years of infallible and outstanding service to all of us.
This presents us with a challenge as Jim uses Redstone as his summer home and so has been available on-site at almost all times. We must elect a new Road Manager but since it is unlikely that anyone will be available full-time throughout the cottage season, it has been proposed that we elect a committee rather than a single person for this task.
Discussion: Jim to list the jobs of the Road Manager, to become part of the bylaws.
Discussion for volunteers or election of a new Road Manager committee.
Resolved at the meeting:
Road Manager duties include, but not limited to:
nbsp; Arrange to grade our section at the same time as Boice-Bradley road is graded to minimize costs
Supervise grading
Arrange for brush removal (work team)
Arrange and co-ordinate annual work group
Supervise all contracted road work to assure desired requirements are met
Work with Miller’s lake group to arrange maintenance along with the Boice-Bradley road to minimize costs
Present road information and suggestions at annual general meeting
New road Manager committee:
Boyd and Brad have volunteered to be the new road managers, positions to be reviewed each year at the annual meeting(s).
Jim has agreed to give transitional assistance where required.
Suggest a member of Miller’s Lake group be asked to join our Road Management team to coordinate work on both sections to minimize costs.
Item 3 -- Road Issues
The road was never intended nor built to be a 4-seasons road nor to withstand vehicle and heavy truck traffic during the rainy season.
Discussion: restrictions of truck and car usage and criteria thereof.
signage to make it clear to all drivers of the restricted periods. Consider a sign with fixed dates for all years or a changeable sign that can be updated by the Road Manager or his appointee when the road is deemed usable.
rules on what happens if trucks go on the road during those times, and the penalties or compensation.
Discussion -- Bylaw: effect of winter plowing and surface gravel erosion and who is responsible for repairs
Discussion – Bylaw: road obstruction removal responsibility such as fallen trees. In the past, Jim W. has been instrumental in clearing the road as necessary but this luxury is now changing due to changes in road usage periods.
Discussion -- Bylaw: basic road rules regarding general appearance: garbage, dumping, scrap building materials (concrete, lumber scraps etc.), cutting of trees (respect of other people’s property), abandoned vehicles.
Resolved at the Meeting
The condition of the road as it will be once the repairs and upgrades are completed this year, will be the accepted standard. Any further upgrades to a higher standard are not the responsibility of the Road Association.
The condition of the road will be monitored by the road managers and the current state published on the website. Before coming to Redstone, especially in the rainy or snow seasons, check the website for road condition. All members agree that if the road is posted as closed, they will not use it. Any costs for damage incurred from use of the road during such periods is the sole responsibility of the user.
Anyone finding the road impassable but not correctly listed on the website is requested to please contact one of the road managers (check website for email addresses and phone numbers) so the website may be updated.
Winter plowing: members wishing to have the snow removed during the winter season are responsible for all costs as well as for any damage incurred from the plowing operation. All members who decide to use the road in the winter will agree among themselves regarding the division of costs.
Fallen tree removal: After a violent storm, if power has been interrupted, we can often depend on Hydro to remove trees blocking the road; this is to our advantage if we are willing to wait for them. Fallen trees may be removed by whomever first uses the road, at their own expense; users are advised to come prepared especially after a violent storm or during early season opening of the road.
Appearance: it is agreed that debris (such as construction materials or storm damaged vehicles, etc) will be promptly removed by the person owning the material. It is important to all members that the road be kept in an attractive and unlimited condition.
Item 4 -- Fee Structure
Discussion: our present financial situation:
Annual fees are currently $300 per cottage
Bank balance is currently $6034. It is felt that this is a suitable amount to keep in reserve for major disasters to the road, such as from another tornado or violent storm.
Two members are in arrears for 2007 dues ($300 + $200).
Our main recurring liability is the payment to Miller’s Lake Road Association fees which were raised to $200 per person during last August’s general meeting. This now consumes two-thirds of our revenue.
This leaves only $100 per person (one third) for annual road maintenance such as addition of gravel, grading and brush removal.
In past years, we have been paying the Miller’s Lake fee in total, regardless of whether our members are paid up or not. Because of the fee increase, as of last November, the treasurer advised Lon that we would only be able to pay Miller’s fees for members who are paid in full. Lon agreed that this was reasonable. Because of this, $400 is currently outstanding to Miller’s Lake for our two members in arrears.
Some of us are concerned about rising road fees.
Discussion -- Bylaw: future road upgrades. Some cottagers are satisfied with the current condition and intent of the road; others wish it to be upgraded to a “four-seasons” road.
Discussion – Bylaw re: Amount of Road Fees:
Overall budget requirements for 2008-2009
rates for use of the road, whether all year, or seasonal use (there are varying thoughts on this from different cottagers)
Discuss: fee based on usage (very difficult to implement)
Discuss: fee based on property assessment (easier to implement)
Discuss: up-front damage fee, “wear and tear” fee or initiation fee for those bringing in heavy equipment to build a new dwelling.
Resolved at the meeting:
we will maintain solidarity at future Annual General Meetings (AGM) to overrule unnecessary road fee increases payable to Miller’s lake Association and the East Bay Cottage Association.
to ensure that all of our members have a vote at the AGM, we will introduce a Proxy Vote system. Every member agrees to appoint a member who will be attending the AGM to vote as his or her proxy. We will put a proxy form on the web for easy printing.
Whereas it has been agreed that the road does not require any further capital costs for upgrading to a four-seasons road, therefore it is agreed the fee structure will remain basically unchanged, with a minor incentive and firm due date as discussed in Item 5 below.
Winter maintenance costs will not be added to the fee structure – those (currently three members) who wish to do snow removal will share the costs amongst themselves as a private arrangement.
It was requested that those doing snow removal not heap it up in such a manner as to prevent others from having access to their cottages via foot, skis or snowmobiles.
All agree that the annual member fee assessed by Millers Lake Association for each member (current $200) will not be paid on behalf of delinquent members until such time as their dues arrears are brought up to date.
Item 5 -- Collection of Road Dues
As treasurer, Dave has found it cumbersome to collect Road Dues in a timely manner, partly because he does not spend a great deal of time at Redstone and it is difficult to catch people when they are up. Jim has been instrumental in assisting.
It is difficult to contact people who do not pay, do not have an email address or current address or phone number and sell their property with considerable arrears owing. As an example, Munroes left with $1200 in road dues owing (2002-2005) and we have been unable to collect. This is a hardship for us all as we must all pay their share. Two members are currently in arrears for last year’s dues.
Discussion:
Bylaw: a more rigorous system of dues payment with a set date and method of payment.
suggestion: road fees due Jun 1. This gives treasurer adequate time to attend to missing payments
suggestion: with web access, fees can be deposited directly into treasurer’s account at no charge provided you email when you do it.
suggestion: dues can be paid with PayPal on the website but includes a 3% bank fee (currently $9.25).
Bylaw: discuss whether an invoice should be sent out each year and whether this can be done by email.
Bylaw: consider a penalty for late payment or a bonus for early payment.
Bylaw: Discuss property liens for unpaid fees
Bylaw: Discuss how to keep our address file/phone/email lists up to date for contacting members (web, email, letter, phone call?)
Note you can view Road finances at any time on the web at www.preacherspoint.com to see that your payment has been received. To get the User Name and Password to this financial page, please Email Webmaster. The first time you use this page, you may have to click on the yellow bar at the top of the window to download the Active-X control needed to run the spreadsheet.
Resolved at the meeting:
Road fees for 2008 will remain unchanged at $300, due no later than the AGM
Road fees will increase beginning in 2009, to $350.00 per cottage per year, with a possible discount as noted below.
Fees will be due and payable no later than June 1 of the year. For example, the 2009 fees must be paid no later than June 1, 2009.
As an incentive for those paying on time, a $50.00 discount may be taken if your payment is received no later than the June 1 deadline each year.
Fees are to be paid to the treasurer (currently Dave Long)
Options for Fee Payment:
Fees paid by cheque: see treasurer’s mailing address on the Home Page
Fees can be paid electronically via credit card through PayPal directly on the website (click on the PayPal link; note there is a 3% charge).
Fees can be paid through your internet banking directly to our bank as a simple “bill payment”; contact Dave Long for details if you want to use this no-cost method.
Fees can be paid by cheque or cash directly if you catch Dave or Marguerite at the lake (705-754-4653).
fees can be deposited in the mail slot soon to be at the top of the staircase at Longs cottage -- 1608 Preachers lane (NO CASH Please!!!)
Item 6 -- Other Issues
Discussion: re opposing, as a group, any future random fee increases for the associated road associations in view of the fact that
for the East Bay Cottage Association: there are allegedly users who never pay and therefore all others must pay extra.
for our section of the road: Dr. H., because of some past agreement that we were not party to, does not pay for his use of the highest maintenance section of our road.
no proper financial analysis has been presented to justify fee increases other than a vague profit and loss statement with discrepancies and missing data.
Discuss: how to ensure that new cottagers agree to the bylaws and meet any fee requirements (see below) before purchasing land or beginning new construction.
Annual road maintenance – how to get everybody to participate in one way or another, together or independently.
Resolved at the meeting:
Two recent fee increases assessed through the Miller’s Lake Association (MLA) have put our finances in serious jeopardy. While they may have been justified, we have no way of verifying this as we do not receive meaningful financial information from the MLA.
it was resolved that we will request full financial details from the MLA that show, in a manner similar to our ledger posted on the web, the full details of which of their members have paid, who have not paid, and full details of what all road fees, including our own, are being used for.
All members will ensure that we have full representation at all future AGM’s via the proxy system mentioned above so that further fee increases are not unnecessarily assessed without proper financial documentation and approval by ALL our members, even those unable to attend.
Discussion was made regarding legal action on delinquent accounts as well as some way to collect dues when property changes hands but nothing was resolved at this time.
Discussion was made regarding registering the new bylaws (when complete) on title to ensure that new owners are aware that they must not only join our association and pay annual road fees, but are also responsible for any arrears from the previous owner. Brad agreed to investigate this further.
it was agreed that we should endeavor to call a meeting such as this each spring in advance of the AGM as all agreed it was productive and necessary.
it was agreed that the Road Managers would schedule a work-group for annual road cleanup preferably in August so that the most number of cottagers would be available to participate. Labour Day weekend was ruled unsuitable due to normal family arrangements that would interfere.
Note: the gate at the entrance to Miller’s will be locked for a day and re-opened in order to meet (legal) requirements to maintain "private road" status – this will be done by Jim W. at a time to avoid disruption of service, when he comes up mid-April
End of Meeting -- Jim W. adjourned
Snacks were served, thanks to Grazyna and Paul.